Gov't: Comms database has to happen

Daily Newsletters

Sign up to ZDNet UK's daily newsletter.

NEWS

The home secretary has stressed the need for even greater surveillance powers for government.

In a speech to an Institute for Public Policy Research commission on Wednesday, the home secretary, Jacqui Smith, said the introduction of new laws to monitor modern communications is necessary in order to combat terrorism and serious crime.

The Home Office is already consulting on plans, due to come into effect in 2009, that would require all ISPs to keep the 'who', 'when' and 'where' details of all web, VoIP and messaging traffic for at least 12 months, bringing the UK in line with an EU directive.

Telecoms operators are already required to store similar details of phone calls and text messages for an equivalent length of time.

In her speech, Smith suggested that forthcoming legislation will go further than simply making it a statutory requirement to retain online traffic details for at least 12 months.

She said: "The changes we need to make may require legislation. The safeguards we will want to put in place certainly will. And we may need legislation to test what a solution will look like."

Smith was thought to be referring to plans proposed under the Interception Modernisation Programme (IMP), which are believed to include proposals to siphon details of internet traffic from ISPs and store it in a central government database for at least 12 months.

Lord West of Spithead revealed that the IMP and the Communications Data Bill, due for its first reading in December, are bound together when he told Parliament in July 2008 that more details on the IMP would be available after the draft bill is published this December.

A spokesperson for the Information Commissioner's Office opposed the move towards a centralised database, saying: "It is important to highlight that creating large collections of data is not a risk-free option."

"This not only engages concerns about unwarranted intrusion into the lives of every citizen, it also raises worries about making sure that people's personal information is properly safeguarded, is not misused and can never fall into the wrong hands," said the spokesperson.

Smith said public consultation on any legislation relating to communications retention will begin in the new year.

She added that there are no plans to keep the contents of emails, texts, instant messages or phone calls, and that local authorities will not be given powers to listen in on calls.

She said: "Our ability to intercept communications and obtain communications data is vital to fighting terrorism and combating serious crime, including child sex abuse, murder and drugs trafficking."

"But the communications revolution has been rapid in this country and the way in which we intercept communications and collect communications data needs to change too," Smith said.

Talkback

If you send an email from your UK ISP supplied email account to another UK ISP supplied email account, then your traffic will be logged under these new proposals; but then the traffic is already being logged today and the ISP can be forced to give it up to the "authorities" for the flimsiest of reasons. eg checking that your kid is enrolled in the right school.

If you use:

- An offshore https web based email account.
- An offshore conventional email server over an SSL connection.
- A UK based, self hosted email server with SSL.

Then any of these (and probably more examples I have yet to think of) will completely bypass these regulations and be utterly invisible to the snoopers.

If I were planning a criminal enterprise and wanted to chat about it with my co-conspirators, I would probably set up a self hosted email server and equip my fellows with netbooks, paltops or laptops using a mail client enabled for IMAPS & SMTPS and WiFi and configure them to use my new email server. When the jobs done, I would 7xcrypto-wipe the hard drive and sell the whole lot at a car boot sale.

Given that there are so many ways round these proposals, one of three scenarios applies. I encourage fellow correspondents to vote for the one they think applies here :-)

1) Jaqubootie Smith and her fellow travellers haven't even got the first clue about IT and genuinely think that the bad people are going fall for their dastardly ploy and march themselves into prison in lines two abreast.

2) They know about these work arounds and don't care because they're not actually worried about results, or how much it will all cost or indeed the gross, un-British invasion of individual privacy; they just want the "Tough on Crime" headlines in the hope "The Great Unwashed" will be impressed and vote for them.

3) They know about these work arounds and don't care because they actually want the data on us; the vast majority of law abiding subjects. This begs the question WHY they might want to pokey nose on us in this way, but none the less they do seem to get off on that sort of thing.

Me? I'm going with 2) .. plus a side order of 3) for texture and added interest.

Andrew Meredith 16 October, 2008 14:02
Reply

Unfortunately, reality suggests otherwise

Tezzer 16 October, 2008 22:12
Reply

I had to laugh at your comment "the Great Unwashed" well I do shave !! but seriously, I totally agree with your arguments and what worries me regarding company site security is that the British gov is currently improving its trackrecord of leaving data on trains, suffering data theft left right and centre so how can we be sure that their snooped stuff which can easily include perfectly innocent company trade secrets are not going to be discovered dumped on a bus for anyone to look at and perhaps use? It's the government's lack of security acumen that worries me the most. They need to get their own House in order first before they start poking around copying everything they lay their hands on. They will take more data than they have eyes to evaluate so there will be a lot of data that they have no control over and the data left on buses etc, might include inventions like mine that I definitely don't want seen by my competitors before we launch our products. With the government data theft levels as high as they are, it won't be long before companies end up being blackmailed by "passengers" for the return of stolen data. Meanwhile, real professional criminals will evade IT detection anyway. so I do not see the advantages of these government snooping and copying strategies.

Lindsay Fraser 22 October, 2008 16:10
Reply

Throw away email addresses, proxy IP addresses, buying pay as you go sim cards from Tesco with cash.... all going to grow in volume. Don't get the point of all this. If you're clever, you disappear under the radar anyway. Buy with cash, surf over open wifi networks (Milton Keynes springs to mind). How on earth do the 'powers that be' expect this to improve security. It'll drive illicit use of IT and comms underground. Only the fool will be caught. With handsets costing £12.00 each, just bin the mobile when you've committed the crime.

Richard A Johnson 22 October, 2008 20:48
Reply

Actually, they are already setting up plans to cover that. The idea is that you won't be able to buy a mobile phone at all without presenting your passport.

Rather begs the question of a little old lady who's never stepped out of her village and has no desire to do so.

Tezzer 22 October, 2008 21:56
Reply

Post your comment

In order to post a comment you need to be registered and logged in.

You can also log in with Facebook. Log in or create your ZDNet UK account below

  • Login

Will not be displayed with your comment

By signing up for this service, you indicate that you agree to our Terms and Conditions and have read and understood our Privacy Policy. Questions about membership? Find the answers in the Community FAQ

Get ZDNet UK's daily newsletter

Enter your email address to sign up

ZDNet UK Live

Burn-IT

What happens when one hosting platform "acquires data" from another? If I forced the first one to remove it, who is responsible for chasing the...

4 hours ago by Burn-IT on Google picks holes in EU's 'right to be forgotten'
JohnTalich

iSpring Pro is a nice tool, that allows PowerPoint to SCORM conversion. They also have free tool, that also generates SCORM compliant courses.

8 hours ago by JohnTalich on How To Convert PowerPoint To SCORM Compliant Course
aaron.sloman

I think the answer to the question requires a deeper analysis of where the income can come from who else is now competing for it, who else will be...

16 hours ago by aaron.sloman on The three big questions about Facebook's IPO
Brent Pieczynski

Your correctness about Government websites not being compliant with their own websites is correct. Most criticism of other people takes so many...

22 hours ago by Brent Pieczynski on Privacy watchdog to chase big companies over cookie law
Kelvyn Taylor

802.11ac does promise some tricks to improve range & reliability, but not sure how these will work in practice until I get real products to play...

22 hours ago by Kelvyn Taylor via Facebook on Next-generation 802.11ac routers
mrudang009

My wife and I love our new Kindle Fire. It's lightweight, easy to use and has a great interface. The first thing I recommend anyone with a new...

22 hours ago by mrudang009 on Waterstones to sell Kindles with in-store offers
mrudang009

It basically unlocks all the Android marketplace apps and unlocks the device. I am one very happy Kindle owner!

22 hours ago by mrudang009 on Waterstones to sell Kindles with in-store offers
Burn-IT

Skittles with tapes and coffee cups. Old tapes so we didn't have to rewind them afterwards.

24 hours ago by Burn-IT on Ten IT jobs to save up for those rare lulls
Fraud_fighter

What is mildly amusing to me is when someone thinks a strong password is as strong as one may need, when the truth is usernames and passwords are...

1 day ago by Fraud_fighter on Passwords are here to stay: get used to it
Andy Bolstridge

Performance isn't really the big thing at the moment - not when my ADSL connection will only provide a 8mbps bottleneck to the 3.5gbps speeds these...

1 day ago by Andy Bolstridge via Facebook on Next-generation 802.11ac routers
pjc158

So when is Amazon buying Waterstones?

1 day ago by pjc158 on Waterstones to sell Kindles with in-store offers
J.A. Watson

@JoshArg - Well, I am writing this from my N150 Plus, running Ubuntu 12.04 and using a Bluetooth mouse (well, to be totally correct it is a...

1 day ago by J.A. Watson on Samsung N150 Plus Netbook - Ubuntu Netbook Edition 10.04
J.A. Watson

@duncanjmurray - At least n the case of the specific system I put the SSD into, it is not the case. The boot time improvement is substantial, but...

1 day ago by J.A. Watson on Netbook Upgrade - SSD IN, Windows OUT
archerthom

Sounds like only those who have bought their Kindle from Waterstones will be able to use them in-store - very disappointing. I have no intention...

1 day ago by archerthom on Waterstones to sell Kindles with in-store offers
AndyPagin

From my mainframe operating days... 1) Play hoopla with write permit rings & a can of screen cleaner. 2) Make enormous paper chains (Christmas...

1 day ago by AndyPagin on Ten IT jobs to save up for those rare lulls
61253

An OS X perspective Filenames beginning with a dot/period (.) should not be equated with HFS Plus resource forks; misunderstandings around ._ (dot...

1 day ago by 61253 on SharePoint deployment: Pitfalls of a pioneer
ians1

There are many legal download sites for music at least that do not charge an arm and a leg like itunes or Napster. The "real" cost of an mp3 file...

1 day ago by ians1 on The Pirate Bay infringes copyright, High Court decides
Jon Howells

@Crupal.. How does refusing your websites cookies help my privacy? A quick look at your page script reveals four sets of code provided by 3rd...

2 days ago by Jon Howells via Facebook on Privacy watchdog to chase big companies over cookie law
Paul Carloss

There are hundreds, if not thousands of filesharing torrent sites, The Pirate Bay (TPB) is only one of them, while the TPB is blocked many more...

2 days ago by Paul Carloss via Facebook on The Pirate Bay infringes copyright, High Court decides
Rebin Simpson

So could users DownGrade if the new OS didn't worked correctly ?

2 days ago by Rebin Simpson on Sony delivers on Xperia Ice Cream Sandwich promise