Pub 'fined £8k' for Wi-Fi copyright infringement

Daily Newsletters

Sign up to ZDNet UK's daily newsletter.

NEWS

A pub owner has been fined £8,000 because someone unlawfully downloaded copyrighted material over their open Wi-Fi hotspot, according to the managing director of hotspot provider The Cloud.

Graham Cove told ZDNet UK on Friday he believes the case to be the first of its kind in the UK. However, he would not identify the pub concerned, because its owner — a pubco that is a client of The Cloud's — had not yet given their permission for the case to be publicised.

Cove would say only that the fine had been levied in a civil case, brought about by a rights holder, "sometime this summer". The Cloud's pubco clients include Fullers, Greene King, Marsdens, Scottish & Newcastle, Mitchell & Butlers and Punch Taverns.

The law surrounding open Wi-Fi networks and the liability of those running them is a grey area.

According to internet law professor Lilian Edwards, of Sheffield Law School, where a business operates an open Wi-Fi spot to give customers or visitors internet access, they would be "not be responsible in theory" for users' unlawful downloads, under "existing substantive copyright law".

She also said the measures that would be brought in under the Digital Economy Bill — measures that could include disconnection of the account holder — would not apply because the business could be classified as a public communications service provider, which would make it exempt. According to the terms of the bill, only "subscribers" can be targeted with sanctions.

According to legal advice sent to The Cloud by the law firm Faegre & Benson on 17 August, "Wi-Fi hotspots in public and enterprise environments providing access to the internet to members of the public, free or paid, are public communications services".

A public communications service provider must, under the terms of the Data Retention Regulations that came into force in the UK in April of this year, retain records for 12 months on communications that have taken place over their network. This data includes user IDs, the times and dates of access, and the online destinations that were being accessed. The content of the communications cannot be retained without the user's permission, due to data-protection laws.

However, there is a get-out clause in the Data Retention Regulations, in that no public communications service provider has to keep such records unless they are notified by the government that they are required to do so.

According to Edwards, this is because "only the big six ISPs have the facilities to comply, and because the government agreed [in its legislation] to repay some of the costs [of retaining such records]". She noted that this clause might itself be non-compliant with the EU data-retention laws that were transposed into UK law in April.

Edwards pointed out that, even if the sanctions proposed in the Digital Economy Bill come into force, "no-one will know who [the downloader] was, because the IP address that will show up [upon investigation] will be of the hotspot". She added that the rights holder seeking infringers of their copyright would probably not know that the IP address in question was not that of a subscriber.

It would then be up to the hotspot operator to point out that they were not the end user downloading copyrighted material. "But when would they get to say that? Maybe straightaway, maybe not until after disconnection — it's not currently clear," Edwards said.

Update: In an earlier version of this story, Professor Lilian Edwards was erroneously quoted as saying that businesses would "be responsible in theory" for users' unlawful downloads, under "existing substantive copyright law". She actually told ZDNet UK that businesses would not be responsible in theory, and we have amended the story accordingly.

Talkback

Consecutively vote monkeys into power, we never learn.

CA 27 November, 2009 19:49
Reply

victims of hit & run accidents can now sue the highways agency for compensation

siarad 28 November, 2009 08:42
Reply

To get a human and objective view of this situation, I find it useful to take a step back and look at the overall concepts rather than pour over the details of copyright or whatever.

We have some guy using a publicly available mechanism to steal something. The maker of the mechanism is OK but the company who bought/leased it are fined, whereas the thief is nowhere to be seen.

Now transfer that concept to something else. If a house burglar gets on a bus made by Scania and operated by First Bus Transport, then breaks into a house to nick a TV, then uses the same bus later to get the TV back to his own house, should First Bus Transport be fined for the burglary?

Fat Pop Do Wop 29 November, 2009 00:04
Reply

It is getting sillier by the day taking siarad's comments further where does responsibility end? presumably the Computer Supplier, Manufacturer and Software suppliers are also liable as are their suppliers and so on after all if the computer hadn't been available then the crime could not have taken place. Furthermore if Sir Tim berners Lee hadn't 'invented' the Internet then cybercrime wouldn't exist so ultimately it must be his fault that the crime took place.

58358 30 November, 2009 19:15
Reply

the "media mafia" is trying their dirty tricks again.

They would really like all states to be fascist in nature, then they could have their way all the time.

Time seems to be overdue to make some restrictions on copyrights.
These rights are privileges granted by society and can of cause be corrected by society.

The way they abuse their privileges is not what was intended with copyright laws, when they were first made.
These laws were intended to protect the creators from unscrupulous publishers, NOT the general public.

hkommedal 1 December, 2009 08:08
Reply

Being worried over this I contacted BT FON & the relevant part of the reply is:
[quote]Please note BT FON complies with regulation because we do tunnel the traffic.[/quote]

siarad 1 December, 2009 10:28
Reply

I run a Fonero router at home (not BT Fon), and if I connect to that as a Fon user, packets come from exactly the same IP address as if I connect to my home router as myself. There's no tunnelling, and as far as I can tell any Fon user appears on the other side of the NAT on my WAN interface exactly as any other local user on my LAN.

So I'm not sure what BT means by 'tunnelling' here. Perhaps I should find out!

Rupert Goodwins 3 December, 2009 12:45
Reply

So they are potentially going after anyone who provides access to the net; wireless or not, paid for or not.

This has much wider implications than shutting down wifi hotspots.

They are trying to get firm case law that says 'if you provide access to the internet you are liable for the uses that that access is put to"

Having failed to crush the telco's resistence they're now going after the non-ISPs pubs, coffee shops, my local gym. Organisations who won't spend millions defending their right to offer a 'fun' service. Then when they have the 'point of law' proven they will go after the ISPs

This is extremely worrying and dangerous move. Sadly the man in the street isn;t IT savy enough to protest and the governments are increasingly in the thrall of these copyright crazies lawyers!!

350375 4 December, 2009 18:09
Reply

Post your comment

In order to post a comment you need to be registered and logged in.

You can also log in with Facebook. Log in or create your ZDNet UK account below

  • Login

Will not be displayed with your comment

By signing up for this service, you indicate that you agree to our Terms and Conditions and have read and understood our Privacy Policy. Questions about membership? Find the answers in the Community FAQ

Get ZDNet UK's daily newsletter

Enter your email address to sign up

ZDNet UK Live

BrownieBoy

Agree with other comments. Nobody's going to start reaching out to start tapping their desktop monitors with their fingers. Their arms would tire...

5 hours ago by BrownieBoy on Windows 8 could speed multi-monitor uptake
ju1ce

new to dropbox? sign up here and we both get a 500mb bonus! http://db.tt/aM4pWbT

10 hours ago by ju1ce on Secure2Share: securing your Dropbox
Random_Error

The only way a touch monitor would be any good is if it were horizontal on the desk, with a virtual keyboard so you could do away with that as well...

10 hours ago by Random_Error on Windows 8 could speed multi-monitor uptake
JBDragon

This is just dumb! Forget that I think Windows 8 will bomb, but really, people are going to go out and buy touch Monitors now??? Just pretend...

12 hours ago by JBDragon on Windows 8 could speed multi-monitor uptake
Jake Rayson

@Andy Bolstridge > Unfortunately, we need the majority to work 9-5 And therein lies the lie. I work very hard indeed for my idleness, early starts...

13 hours ago by Jake Rayson on The Idle Self-employed
Burn-IT

What happens when one hosting platform "acquires data" from another? If I forced the first one to remove it, who is responsible for chasing the...

19 hours ago by Burn-IT on Google picks holes in EU's 'right to be forgotten'
JohnTalich

iSpring Pro is a nice tool, that allows PowerPoint to SCORM conversion. They also have free tool, that also generates SCORM compliant courses.

23 hours ago by JohnTalich on How To Convert PowerPoint To SCORM Compliant Course
aaron.sloman

I think the answer to the question requires a deeper analysis of where the income can come from who else is now competing for it, who else will be...

1 day ago by aaron.sloman on The three big questions about Facebook's IPO
Brent Pieczynski

Your correctness about Government websites not being compliant with their own websites is correct. Most criticism of other people takes so many...

2 days ago by Brent Pieczynski on Privacy watchdog to chase big companies over cookie law
Kelvyn Taylor

802.11ac does promise some tricks to improve range & reliability, but not sure how these will work in practice until I get real products to play...

2 days ago by Kelvyn Taylor via Facebook on Next-generation 802.11ac routers
mrudang009

My wife and I love our new Kindle Fire. It's lightweight, easy to use and has a great interface. The first thing I recommend anyone with a new...

2 days ago by mrudang009 on Waterstones to sell Kindles with in-store offers
mrudang009

It basically unlocks all the Android marketplace apps and unlocks the device. I am one very happy Kindle owner!

2 days ago by mrudang009 on Waterstones to sell Kindles with in-store offers
Burn-IT

Skittles with tapes and coffee cups. Old tapes so we didn't have to rewind them afterwards.

2 days ago by Burn-IT on Ten IT jobs to save up for those rare lulls
Fraud_fighter

What is mildly amusing to me is when someone thinks a strong password is as strong as one may need, when the truth is usernames and passwords are...

2 days ago by Fraud_fighter on Passwords are here to stay: get used to it
Andy Bolstridge

Performance isn't really the big thing at the moment - not when my ADSL connection will only provide a 8mbps bottleneck to the 3.5gbps speeds these...

2 days ago by Andy Bolstridge via Facebook on Next-generation 802.11ac routers
pjc158

So when is Amazon buying Waterstones?

2 days ago by pjc158 on Waterstones to sell Kindles with in-store offers
J.A. Watson

@JoshArg - Well, I am writing this from my N150 Plus, running Ubuntu 12.04 and using a Bluetooth mouse (well, to be totally correct it is a...

2 days ago by J.A. Watson on Samsung N150 Plus Netbook - Ubuntu Netbook Edition 10.04
J.A. Watson

@duncanjmurray - At least n the case of the specific system I put the SSD into, it is not the case. The boot time improvement is substantial, but...

2 days ago by J.A. Watson on Netbook Upgrade - SSD IN, Windows OUT
archerthom

Sounds like only those who have bought their Kindle from Waterstones will be able to use them in-store - very disappointing. I have no intention...

2 days ago by archerthom on Waterstones to sell Kindles with in-store offers
AndyPagin

From my mainframe operating days... 1) Play hoopla with write permit rings & a can of screen cleaner. 2) Make enormous paper chains (Christmas...

2 days ago by AndyPagin on Ten IT jobs to save up for those rare lulls